Comments on: One approach to Enterprise Flex development http://flexblog.faratasystems.com/2009/07/10/one-approach-to-enterprise-flex-development A blog about our experience with Adobe Flex Fri, 03 Sep 2010 02:18:04 +0000 http://wordpress.org/?v=2.9.2 hourly 1 By: Shashank http://flexblog.faratasystems.com/2009/07/10/one-approach-to-enterprise-flex-development/comment-page-1#comment-67933 Shashank Thu, 25 Mar 2010 07:08:49 +0000 http://flexblog.faratasystems.com/?p=429#comment-67933 HI Yakov, Its been a great article to pull up the techie like me to somewhat Architecture level Understanding. Its been more or the less happening to be the case of blind Framework following with me. But Surly this article will help me to give my observation in good organized manner to somebody who will ask me about Flex-Java things. Its been a great blog of collective efforts by you guys i have read some basic blogs here like Flex-Servlet/Jsp connectivity, Modifying some BlazeDS stuff.. Its really been a great work. Surly will look forward for CleaToolKit Framework at Source https://sourceforge.net/projects. Thanks for good team work done to promote flex by this Blog. Great Work HI Yakov,
Its been a great article to pull up the techie like me to somewhat Architecture level Understanding. Its been more or the less happening to be the case of blind Framework following with me. But Surly this article will help me to give my observation in good organized manner to somebody who will ask me about Flex-Java things. Its been a great blog of collective efforts by you guys i have read some basic blogs here like Flex-Servlet/Jsp connectivity, Modifying some BlazeDS stuff.. Its really been a great work. Surly will look forward for CleaToolKit Framework at Source https://sourceforge.net/projects. Thanks for good team work done to promote flex by this Blog.

Great Work

]]> By: Rajiv Totlani http://flexblog.faratasystems.com/2009/07/10/one-approach-to-enterprise-flex-development/comment-page-1#comment-51455 Rajiv Totlani Mon, 18 Jan 2010 16:48:58 +0000 http://flexblog.faratasystems.com/?p=429#comment-51455 I have used AMFPHP and don't really get it why these components in the middle really are that important when XML can easily be the standard for converting and deconverting objects. I tried out an an experiment in the Java-Spring-Flex world and withing a day I was - Converting my flex object's based on a class to XML (2 lines of code) - Converting from XML to the right java class using a Thoughwork XML serializing/deserializing utility that works of annotations (so really 2-3 lines of java code and a few annotations) - Persisting the objects in database or executing a query powered by JPA...so smostly annotations again with very little code since I had a base class that powered almost all insert, delete and serach by ID queries that all java objects extended The only thing that I could not do was generate my flex classes from java classes...but is that really that big a deal? So in essence BlazeDS and AMFPHP types make sense only in very very large projects but not for most small or medicore size projects. Take for example the website we built - http;//www.flexdownloads.com....only good ui but plain old php and xml. no drupal, no amfphp. We did evlauate all of those for sure. In hindsight, I will admit that these utilities make the life of a developer slightly easier BUT there is a tradeoff involved with the learning curve, an additional layer etc... My opinions of course, and I could be wrong. I have used AMFPHP and don’t really get it why these components in the middle really are that important when XML can easily be the standard for converting and deconverting objects.

I tried out an an experiment in the Java-Spring-Flex world and withing a day I was
- Converting my flex object’s based on a class to XML (2 lines of code)
- Converting from XML to the right java class using a Thoughwork XML serializing/deserializing utility that works of annotations (so really 2-3 lines of java code and a few annotations)
- Persisting the objects in database or executing a query powered by JPA…so smostly annotations again with very little code since I had a base class that powered almost all insert, delete and serach by ID queries that all java objects extended

The only thing that I could not do was generate my flex classes from java classes…but is that really that big a deal? So in essence BlazeDS and AMFPHP types make sense only in very very large projects but not for most small or medicore size projects.

Take for example the website we built – http;//www.flexdownloads.com….only good ui but plain old php and xml. no drupal, no amfphp. We did evlauate all of those for sure.

In hindsight, I will admit that these utilities make the life of a developer slightly easier BUT there is a tradeoff involved with the learning curve, an additional layer etc…

My opinions of course, and I could be wrong.

]]> By: Yakov Fain http://flexblog.faratasystems.com/2009/07/10/one-approach-to-enterprise-flex-development/comment-page-1#comment-47360 Yakov Fain Wed, 29 Jul 2009 23:38:11 +0000 http://flexblog.faratasystems.com/?p=429#comment-47360 Serge, You can continue using familiar frameworks if you believe that they help in splitting the work between developers and supporting for data exchange between the tiers. But still I'm encouraging using our rich components. You can't go wrong by using smarter data forms, validators, datagrids, comboboxes, Java2Flex generators IN ADDITION to whatever Flex MVC framework you use. It's not either or. Serge,

You can continue using familiar frameworks if you believe that they help in splitting the work between developers and supporting for data exchange between the tiers. But still I’m encouraging using our rich components. You can’t go wrong by using smarter data forms, validators, datagrids, comboboxes, Java2Flex generators IN ADDITION to whatever Flex MVC framework you use. It’s not either or.

]]> By: SergeJ http://flexblog.faratasystems.com/2009/07/10/one-approach-to-enterprise-flex-development/comment-page-1#comment-47358 SergeJ Wed, 29 Jul 2009 17:57:05 +0000 http://flexblog.faratasystems.com/?p=429#comment-47358 Hi Yakov, given your assertion that frameworks encourage bad development; I am confused about why I would want/need to use the Clear Toolkit ? How is it that the years of experience of the developers of such frameworks as PureMVC, Mate, Cairngorm, Parsley, Spring ActionScript count for nothing in your opinion (?), however, we are all encouraged to blindly adopt YOUR set of re-usable components ? Serge Hi Yakov,

given your assertion that frameworks encourage bad development; I am confused about why I would want/need to use the Clear Toolkit ? How is it that the years of experience of the developers of such frameworks as PureMVC, Mate, Cairngorm, Parsley, Spring ActionScript count for nothing in your opinion (?), however, we are all encouraged to blindly adopt YOUR set of re-usable components ?

Serge

]]> By: Yakov Fain http://flexblog.faratasystems.com/2009/07/10/one-approach-to-enterprise-flex-development/comment-page-1#comment-46813 Yakov Fain Mon, 20 Jul 2009 10:38:53 +0000 http://flexblog.faratasystems.com/?p=429#comment-46813 @svashishtha Please re-post. @svashishtha Please re-post.

]]> By: svashishtha http://flexblog.faratasystems.com/2009/07/10/one-approach-to-enterprise-flex-development/comment-page-1#comment-46536 svashishtha Fri, 17 Jul 2009 11:11:55 +0000 http://flexblog.faratasystems.com/?p=429#comment-46536 I have absolutely no clue why my earlier comment has not been posted to this blog :-| I have absolutely no clue why my earlier comment has not been posted to this blog :-|

]]> By: Alessandro Ronchi http://flexblog.faratasystems.com/2009/07/10/one-approach-to-enterprise-flex-development/comment-page-1#comment-46489 Alessandro Ronchi Thu, 16 Jul 2009 14:08:53 +0000 http://flexblog.faratasystems.com/?p=429#comment-46489 Hi Yakov, I totally agree with your assertion that sometimes frameworks tend to complicate rather than simplify the development process. I've always thought that Flex can be considered a framework itself and doesn't necessarily need to be burdened by a framework. Maybe a good approach could be that of using design patterns. In some projects I've adopted the Model View Presenter pattern but I never liked it very much. I'm trying to convince myself that it's time to take a look at Carngorm or PureMVC but since now I didn't. I'm a big fan of you and reading your posts is always a pleasure. Best regards, Alessandro Hi Yakov,
I totally agree with your assertion that sometimes frameworks tend to complicate rather than simplify the development process.

I’ve always thought that Flex can be considered a framework itself and doesn’t necessarily need to be burdened by a framework.
Maybe a good approach could be that of using design patterns.
In some projects I’ve adopted the Model View Presenter pattern but I never liked it very much.

I’m trying to convince myself that it’s time to take a look at Carngorm or PureMVC but since now I didn’t.

I’m a big fan of you and reading your posts is always a pleasure.

Best regards,
Alessandro

]]> By: Yakov Fain http://flexblog.faratasystems.com/2009/07/10/one-approach-to-enterprise-flex-development/comment-page-1#comment-46425 Yakov Fain Wed, 15 Jul 2009 19:44:33 +0000 http://flexblog.faratasystems.com/?p=429#comment-46425 You may want to look at the first chapter of our book that compares frameworks: http://my.safaribooksonline.com/9780596801465 You may want to look at the first chapter of our book that compares frameworks:
http://my.safaribooksonline.com/9780596801465

]]> By: lmaccherone http://flexblog.faratasystems.com/2009/07/10/one-approach-to-enterprise-flex-development/comment-page-1#comment-46033 lmaccherone Fri, 10 Jul 2009 11:43:49 +0000 http://flexblog.faratasystems.com/?p=429#comment-46033 Great post! I too have felt that Flex frameworks did more harm than good and a component-based approach was idea. I've thought of doing an experiment where I create the same app both with and without a framework and then demonstrate how they are different. I'd try to make the same modification to each. I'd pick more than one type of modification to try to find the places where framework-based approach is either more evolvable or has greater separation of concerns so it would be easier for a team to accomplish the change. Of course such an effort has its drawbacks. (1) finding time to learn a framework, (2) picking a framework, etc. Maybe you've already done this. If so, please provide a pointer. Great post! I too have felt that Flex frameworks did more harm than good and a component-based approach was idea. I’ve thought of doing an experiment where I create the same app both with and without a framework and then demonstrate how they are different. I’d try to make the same modification to each. I’d pick more than one type of modification to try to find the places where framework-based approach is either more evolvable or has greater separation of concerns so it would be easier for a team to accomplish the change.

Of course such an effort has its drawbacks. (1) finding time to learn a framework, (2) picking a framework, etc.

Maybe you’ve already done this. If so, please provide a pointer.

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