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	<title>Comments on: Will Flex/Flash make Adobe richer?</title>
	<atom:link href="http://flexblog.faratasystems.com/2006/11/10/will-flex-make-adobe-richer/feed" rel="self" type="application/rss+xml" />
	<link>http://flexblog.faratasystems.com/2006/11/10/will-flex-make-adobe-richer</link>
	<description>A blog about our experience with Adobe Flex</description>
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		<title>By: Imtiaz</title>
		<link>http://flexblog.faratasystems.com/2006/11/10/will-flex-make-adobe-richer/comment-page-1#comment-6091</link>
		<dc:creator>Imtiaz</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 28 Mar 2007 10:59:43 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://flexblog.faratasystems.com/?p=114#comment-6091</guid>
		<description>I enjoy working with cool components. Yes the  Flex is definitely coooooooooooooooool............................</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I enjoy working with cool components. Yes the  Flex is definitely coooooooooooooooool&#8230;&#8230;&#8230;&#8230;&#8230;&#8230;&#8230;&#8230;&#8230;.</p>
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		<title>By: Martin</title>
		<link>http://flexblog.faratasystems.com/2006/11/10/will-flex-make-adobe-richer/comment-page-1#comment-724</link>
		<dc:creator>Martin</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 16 Nov 2006 20:28:15 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://flexblog.faratasystems.com/?p=114#comment-724</guid>
		<description>My point was that Flex and Flex Data Services are a PART of &quot;Enterprise Products&quot; which in total account for approximately 15% of the total (what I was told).  The bulk of the revenues come from all the other products, Photoshop, Illustrator, Flash, Acrobat, Premiere, After Effects, etc.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>My point was that Flex and Flex Data Services are a PART of &#8220;Enterprise Products&#8221; which in total account for approximately 15% of the total (what I was told).  The bulk of the revenues come from all the other products, Photoshop, Illustrator, Flash, Acrobat, Premiere, After Effects, etc.</p>
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		<title>By: Yakov Fain</title>
		<link>http://flexblog.faratasystems.com/2006/11/10/will-flex-make-adobe-richer/comment-page-1#comment-716</link>
		<dc:creator>Yakov Fain</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 14 Nov 2006 10:49:34 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://flexblog.faratasystems.com/?p=114#comment-716</guid>
		<description>Martin, this blog is about Flex, not Adobe&#039;s revenues in general. LiveCycle is not Flex even though Flex may generate LiveCycle sales.
But since you know some numbers, what accounts for other 85% of the revenues?</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Martin, this blog is about Flex, not Adobe&#8217;s revenues in general. LiveCycle is not Flex even though Flex may generate LiveCycle sales.<br />
But since you know some numbers, what accounts for other 85% of the revenues?</p>
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		<title>By: Martin</title>
		<link>http://flexblog.faratasystems.com/2006/11/10/will-flex-make-adobe-richer/comment-page-1#comment-715</link>
		<dc:creator>Martin</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 14 Nov 2006 05:18:13 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://flexblog.faratasystems.com/?p=114#comment-715</guid>
		<description>To put things in perspective though...  I&#039;ve been told that Adobe&#039;s &quot;Enterprise Products&quot;, which include products like FDS, LiveCycle, etc. only account for approximately 15% of their overall revenues.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>To put things in perspective though&#8230;  I&#8217;ve been told that Adobe&#8217;s &#8220;Enterprise Products&#8221;, which include products like FDS, LiveCycle, etc. only account for approximately 15% of their overall revenues.</p>
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		<title>By: judah</title>
		<link>http://flexblog.faratasystems.com/2006/11/10/will-flex-make-adobe-richer/comment-page-1#comment-693</link>
		<dc:creator>judah</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 11 Nov 2006 23:23:28 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://flexblog.faratasystems.com/?p=114#comment-693</guid>
		<description>Thats a good question. If they give stuff away free does that help them or hurt them. I say, dont ask. If it was not a good move for them they would not have done it. 

If you look at a university, you see you have constant inflow of income. You have 1000+ students per semester needing PS, AI, DW, In Design, Premeire, Flash, other Adobe software, etc. Then multiply that by 10000 universities and local colleges across the US and the world. Even at education discount that is a lot of money. Now add all the freelance agents. Some have just graduated. They must buy the full versions, some will, some wont. Now add in upgrades. If we were at Adobe we could look at the sales reports and see what is generating the money. Then focus on that area and take necessary actions. 

If they are giving things away then I would think they are doing ok. :)</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Thats a good question. If they give stuff away free does that help them or hurt them. I say, dont ask. If it was not a good move for them they would not have done it. </p>
<p>If you look at a university, you see you have constant inflow of income. You have 1000+ students per semester needing PS, AI, DW, In Design, Premeire, Flash, other Adobe software, etc. Then multiply that by 10000 universities and local colleges across the US and the world. Even at education discount that is a lot of money. Now add all the freelance agents. Some have just graduated. They must buy the full versions, some will, some wont. Now add in upgrades. If we were at Adobe we could look at the sales reports and see what is generating the money. Then focus on that area and take necessary actions. </p>
<p>If they are giving things away then I would think they are doing ok. <img src='http://flexblog.faratasystems.com/wp-includes/images/smilies/icon_smile.gif' alt=':)' class='wp-smiley' /> </p>
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		<title>By: Xiaolei Shi</title>
		<link>http://flexblog.faratasystems.com/2006/11/10/will-flex-make-adobe-richer/comment-page-1#comment-689</link>
		<dc:creator>Xiaolei Shi</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 11 Nov 2006 04:37:29 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://flexblog.faratasystems.com/?p=114#comment-689</guid>
		<description>[Anatole] &quot;more acceptable to http://www.msdewey.com/ kind of interaction.&quot;

You are out of your mind, in a bad/nonprofitable way. 

[Bjorn] &quot;The terms ubiquity and success go hand in hand.&quot;

a very broad generalization, hardy descriptive of the current topology. RSS is ubiquitious, does RSS immediately imply profit? 
Ubiquity and sucess go hand in hand only if there is a viable profit mechanism.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>[Anatole] &#8220;more acceptable to <a href="http://www.msdewey.com/" rel="nofollow">http://www.msdewey.com/</a> kind of interaction.&#8221;</p>
<p>You are out of your mind, in a bad/nonprofitable way. </p>
<p>[Bjorn] &#8220;The terms ubiquity and success go hand in hand.&#8221;</p>
<p>a very broad generalization, hardy descriptive of the current topology. RSS is ubiquitious, does RSS immediately imply profit?<br />
Ubiquity and sucess go hand in hand only if there is a viable profit mechanism.</p>
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		<title>By: Bjorn Schultheiss</title>
		<link>http://flexblog.faratasystems.com/2006/11/10/will-flex-make-adobe-richer/comment-page-1#comment-686</link>
		<dc:creator>Bjorn Schultheiss</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 11 Nov 2006 01:42:03 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://flexblog.faratasystems.com/?p=114#comment-686</guid>
		<description>The terms ubiquity and success go hand in hand.

I think the Flash business model is representative of a modern day successful business model.
YouTube and MySpace followed suit. Free registration, Free upload, Free customization. The result, ubiquity in the marketplace.
Ubiquity then translating to cashflow.

It will be interesting to see if the Microsoft model continues to work with the release of Vista.
Vista is not cheap and the only chance i can see them having of making Vista ubiquitous is pirated copies reaching home users.

So if the software is to be release free in these modern times, where is the money to be made for software development companies.
Interesting question?
Currently the bread and butter for the software industry is the enterprise sector. 
I guess this is where Adobe is planning to cash in from their FDS Clustered servers.

But there has to be more opportunity.
Perhaps a different way of thinking, something more righteous perhaps?</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>The terms ubiquity and success go hand in hand.</p>
<p>I think the Flash business model is representative of a modern day successful business model.<br />
YouTube and MySpace followed suit. Free registration, Free upload, Free customization. The result, ubiquity in the marketplace.<br />
Ubiquity then translating to cashflow.</p>
<p>It will be interesting to see if the Microsoft model continues to work with the release of Vista.<br />
Vista is not cheap and the only chance i can see them having of making Vista ubiquitous is pirated copies reaching home users.</p>
<p>So if the software is to be release free in these modern times, where is the money to be made for software development companies.<br />
Interesting question?<br />
Currently the bread and butter for the software industry is the enterprise sector.<br />
I guess this is where Adobe is planning to cash in from their FDS Clustered servers.</p>
<p>But there has to be more opportunity.<br />
Perhaps a different way of thinking, something more righteous perhaps?</p>
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		<title>By: Yakov</title>
		<link>http://flexblog.faratasystems.com/2006/11/10/will-flex-make-adobe-richer/comment-page-1#comment-685</link>
		<dc:creator>Yakov</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 10 Nov 2006 21:20:56 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://flexblog.faratasystems.com/?p=114#comment-685</guid>
		<description>Anatole,

Please do not apply for Adobe&#039;s CFO position - we need you  here :)

Yakov</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Anatole,</p>
<p>Please do not apply for Adobe&#8217;s CFO position - we need you  here :)</p>
<p>Yakov</p>
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		<title>By: Valery Silaev</title>
		<link>http://flexblog.faratasystems.com/2006/11/10/will-flex-make-adobe-richer/comment-page-1#comment-684</link>
		<dc:creator>Valery Silaev</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 10 Nov 2006 20:58:55 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://flexblog.faratasystems.com/?p=114#comment-684</guid>
		<description>Some thoughts about your &quot;ubiquitous free&quot; software examples

There is another company, Sun Microsystems that has ubiquitous free software called Java

Let us be fair. Sun has invented Java, this is a fact. But it was IBM that hardly influenced marketing success of Java. It was IBM subsidiary that created crap like java.uitl.Calendar and java.math.BigDecimal and a lot of classes in J2SE standard library. It was IBM that moved Java towards J2EE and promoted J2EE. So Java belongs to IBM, de-facto.
Hardly believe that we see any JSR that does not conform to IBM agendas. Do you remember JDO? ;)

Almost forgot about yet another ubiquitous free software: Google search. But these guys sell advertisements

C&#039;mon! They sell __analytic results / statistics__ collected with &quot;ubiquitous free&quot; software. I can&#039;t even image how much they earn... But I guess comparing to this, advertisement is like a nickel found on the road vs yearly salary of good IT specialist ;) 

NONE

Hmm... I&#039;d put a small reference to JBoss here. Yet another &quot;ubiquitous free&quot; software, that allows JBoss LLC company to earn good money from services &amp; support and, moreover, beat commercial vendors like IBM and BEA in Europe.

VS</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Some thoughts about your &#8220;ubiquitous free&#8221; software examples</p>
<p>There is another company, Sun Microsystems that has ubiquitous free software called Java</p>
<p>Let us be fair. Sun has invented Java, this is a fact. But it was IBM that hardly influenced marketing success of Java. It was IBM subsidiary that created crap like java.uitl.Calendar and java.math.BigDecimal and a lot of classes in J2SE standard library. It was IBM that moved Java towards J2EE and promoted J2EE. So Java belongs to IBM, de-facto.<br />
Hardly believe that we see any JSR that does not conform to IBM agendas. Do you remember JDO? <img src='http://flexblog.faratasystems.com/wp-includes/images/smilies/icon_wink.gif' alt=';)' class='wp-smiley' /> </p>
<p>Almost forgot about yet another ubiquitous free software: Google search. But these guys sell advertisements</p>
<p>C&#8217;mon! They sell __analytic results / statistics__ collected with &#8220;ubiquitous free&#8221; software. I can&#8217;t even image how much they earn&#8230; But I guess comparing to this, advertisement is like a nickel found on the road vs yearly salary of good IT specialist <img src='http://flexblog.faratasystems.com/wp-includes/images/smilies/icon_wink.gif' alt=';)' class='wp-smiley' />  </p>
<p>NONE</p>
<p>Hmm&#8230; I&#8217;d put a small reference to JBoss here. Yet another &#8220;ubiquitous free&#8221; software, that allows JBoss LLC company to earn good money from services &amp; support and, moreover, beat commercial vendors like IBM and BEA in Europe.</p>
<p>VS</p>
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		<title>By: Anatole Tartakovsky</title>
		<link>http://flexblog.faratasystems.com/2006/11/10/will-flex-make-adobe-richer/comment-page-1#comment-683</link>
		<dc:creator>Anatole Tartakovsky</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 10 Nov 2006 20:02:03 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://flexblog.faratasystems.com/?p=114#comment-683</guid>
		<description>YouTube is actually not a bad example as it encourages developers to at least buy couple of copies of Flash, and some streaming servers. What really going to hurt is PhotoshopLite built in Apollo 8 month from now - actuall taking a chunk from the revenue.

Adobe can stay in software business and keep growing beyond your expectations. They can put a lot of companies out of business while making money - as long as they concentrate on the targets bigger then themselves.
Here are trivial examples (I will limit myself to Macromedia side):

Build Adobe Office 
Create direct replacement for Excel, Word and Outlook @19 per copy or per year (with related discounts for goverment and educational sites) - do the math how this model will work in the current market. Provide data/corp email hosting deal with Yahoo or whoever wants to sell it - with integrated spam / virus scanning
Done with everybodies target #1, moving on

Build Adobe Server.
Just bind MediaServer Lite(very limited bandwith ) and Flex Express in virtualized linux package - micro kernel to go into home server or corp infrastructure. With minimal developers support it would put YouTube, Phone, NetFlix and expensive VoIP out of businesses and new businesses - and can be priced based on the bandwidth. With server in homes and push technology, completely new class of services/subscriptions/advertisement can be done. Hardware manufacturers and cable companies would line up for it.

Build better mose traps. Breeze is a good example of the product you can work into any service/product. I am getting tired og google ads and more acceptable to http://www.msdewey.com/ kind of interaction. Make no mistake - Microsoft is using Adobe Flash technology on msdewey.com to see how to build better mousetraps for Google and Yahoo customers right now - learning the behavioral patterns and online INTERACTIVE selling to the focus group of the whole world using every bit of geographical and other information it can find. Education, publishing, training, personal services, advertisement can build on the top of more interactive web experience  - sell aggresively Breeze servers via partners/ISPs (base + bandwidth model again, that&#039;s what ISP are charging anyway  ) and use it to cross sell other consumer products - videophones, games, interactive tourist maps, one-on-one sessions.

Provide cross businesses on the top of that.  Rebuild partners program and make it more specialized. Make it really simple for the end-users.

Oh well, have to go - save the rest of the world

Sincerely,
Anatole Tartakovsky</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>YouTube is actually not a bad example as it encourages developers to at least buy couple of copies of Flash, and some streaming servers. What really going to hurt is PhotoshopLite built in Apollo 8 month from now &#8211; actuall taking a chunk from the revenue.</p>
<p>Adobe can stay in software business and keep growing beyond your expectations. They can put a lot of companies out of business while making money &#8211; as long as they concentrate on the targets bigger then themselves.<br />
Here are trivial examples (I will limit myself to Macromedia side):</p>
<p>Build Adobe Office<br />
Create direct replacement for Excel, Word and Outlook @19 per copy or per year (with related discounts for goverment and educational sites) &#8211; do the math how this model will work in the current market. Provide data/corp email hosting deal with Yahoo or whoever wants to sell it &#8211; with integrated spam / virus scanning<br />
Done with everybodies target #1, moving on</p>
<p>Build Adobe Server.<br />
Just bind MediaServer Lite(very limited bandwith ) and Flex Express in virtualized linux package &#8211; micro kernel to go into home server or corp infrastructure. With minimal developers support it would put YouTube, Phone, NetFlix and expensive VoIP out of businesses and new businesses &#8211; and can be priced based on the bandwidth. With server in homes and push technology, completely new class of services/subscriptions/advertisement can be done. Hardware manufacturers and cable companies would line up for it.</p>
<p>Build better mose traps. Breeze is a good example of the product you can work into any service/product. I am getting tired og google ads and more acceptable to <a href="http://www.msdewey.com/" rel="nofollow">http://www.msdewey.com/</a> kind of interaction. Make no mistake &#8211; Microsoft is using Adobe Flash technology on msdewey.com to see how to build better mousetraps for Google and Yahoo customers right now &#8211; learning the behavioral patterns and online INTERACTIVE selling to the focus group of the whole world using every bit of geographical and other information it can find. Education, publishing, training, personal services, advertisement can build on the top of more interactive web experience  &#8211; sell aggresively Breeze servers via partners/ISPs (base + bandwidth model again, that&#8217;s what ISP are charging anyway  ) and use it to cross sell other consumer products &#8211; videophones, games, interactive tourist maps, one-on-one sessions.</p>
<p>Provide cross businesses on the top of that.  Rebuild partners program and make it more specialized. Make it really simple for the end-users.</p>
<p>Oh well, have to go &#8211; save the rest of the world</p>
<p>Sincerely,<br />
Anatole Tartakovsky</p>
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		<title>By: Yakov</title>
		<link>http://flexblog.faratasystems.com/2006/11/10/will-flex-make-adobe-richer/comment-page-1#comment-682</link>
		<dc:creator>Yakov</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 10 Nov 2006 19:29:27 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://flexblog.faratasystems.com/?p=114#comment-682</guid>
		<description>Flash Lite is free for developers, but not for the mobile phone vendors.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Flash Lite is free for developers, but not for the mobile phone vendors.</p>
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		<title>By: Renaun Erickson</title>
		<link>http://flexblog.faratasystems.com/2006/11/10/will-flex-make-adobe-richer/comment-page-1#comment-681</link>
		<dc:creator>Renaun Erickson</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 10 Nov 2006 16:54:36 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://flexblog.faratasystems.com/?p=114#comment-681</guid>
		<description>It is kinda of interesting that Flash Lite initial cost $10, but now its free. 
http://www.adobe.com/devnet/devices/articles/flashlite_os/flashlite_os.pdf

 Will Adobe ever try and make money of their players?  In some regards there is more freedom in building a platform then a toll bridge...  They can focus on engineering and not being a troll?  Ok all seriousness, it will be interesting if Adobe ever does decide to move into to something different then just software vendor.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>It is kinda of interesting that Flash Lite initial cost $10, but now its free.<br />
<a href="http://www.adobe.com/devnet/devices/articles/flashlite_os/flashlite_os.pdf" rel="nofollow">http://www.adobe.com/devnet/devices/articles/flashlite_os/flashlite_os.pdf</a></p>
<p> Will Adobe ever try and make money of their players?  In some regards there is more freedom in building a platform then a toll bridge&#8230;  They can focus on engineering and not being a troll?  Ok all seriousness, it will be interesting if Adobe ever does decide to move into to something different then just software vendor.</p>
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